HP-59309A Clock counts only seconds
I have a new-to-me HP-59309A HP-IB Digital Clock. The clock works on
both the internal crystal oscillator and on an external 10 MHz standard
(GPSDO). However, it counts only to 60 seconds and then repeats without
updating the minutes digit. The TIME SET (FAST and SLOW) push-buttons
work but again, the count will not update minutes and hours, only
seconds. The DAY SET procedure works correctly for days and months. All
the other switches and buttons do what they are supposed to do. Using my
10526T logic pulser I can force the minutes and hours counters to work.
The power supply is in good condition (after replacement of a few
components) and I see no other problems (yet).
Tracing the clock signal through the logic circuitry brought me to U3 on
the A4 board. This (U3) is a 4011 quad 2-input NAND gate in a 14-pin DIP
package. It "connects" the seconds counter to the minutes counter and
appears to have failed. One of the people on the email list
hp_agilent_equipment@yahoogroups.com commented that the 4000 series
CMOS chips have a known limited lifetime. Since these parts are no
longer in production, the writer expressed the concern that any parts I
might find to buy may be DOA.
Before I go hunting for parts, I'd appreciate hearing from anyone in the
group who has experience with the 59309A Clock and/or the 4000-series
CMOS family. In particular, are there modern equivalents to my 4011
chip? If the 4000's really do have a limited lifetime I'd rather use a
substitute.
Jeremy, N6WFO
You can get a brand new CD4011BE from pretty much most suppliers at about 15 cents that won't exhibit the problems of the earlier ones.
Dave
-----Original Message-----
From: time-nuts [mailto:time-nuts-bounces@febo.com] On Behalf Of Jeremy Nichols
Sent: 04 April 2017 00:44
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Subject: [time-nuts] HP-59309A Clock counts only seconds
I have a new-to-me HP-59309A HP-IB Digital Clock. The clock works on both the internal crystal oscillator and on an external 10 MHz standard (GPSDO). However, it counts only to 60 seconds and then repeats without updating the minutes digit. The TIME SET (FAST and SLOW) push-buttons work but again, the count will not update minutes and hours, only seconds. The DAY SET procedure works correctly for days and months. All the other switches and buttons do what they are supposed to do. Using my 10526T logic pulser I can force the minutes and hours counters to work.
The power supply is in good condition (after replacement of a few
components) and I see no other problems (yet).
Tracing the clock signal through the logic circuitry brought me to U3 on the A4 board. This (U3) is a 4011 quad 2-input NAND gate in a 14-pin DIP package. It "connects" the seconds counter to the minutes counter and appears to have failed. One of the people on the email list hp_agilent_equipment@yahoogroups.com commented that the 4000 series CMOS chips have a known limited lifetime. Since these parts are no longer in production, the writer expressed the concern that any parts I might find to buy may be DOA.
Before I go hunting for parts, I'd appreciate hearing from anyone in the group who has experience with the 59309A Clock and/or the 4000-series CMOS family. In particular, are there modern equivalents to my 4011 chip? If the 4000's really do have a limited lifetime I'd rather use a substitute.
Jeremy, N6WFO
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
4000 series logic is just fine. Just replace the original parts with like.
Regards
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeremy Nichols" jn6wfo@gmail.com
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Sent: Monday, April 03, 2017 7:43 PM
Subject: [time-nuts] HP-59309A Clock counts only seconds
I have a new-to-me HP-59309A HP-IB Digital Clock. The clock works on both
the internal crystal oscillator and on an external 10 MHz standard (GPSDO).
However, it counts only to 60 seconds and then repeats without updating the
minutes digit. The TIME SET (FAST and SLOW) push-buttons work but again,
the count will not update minutes and hours, only seconds. The DAY SET
procedure works correctly for days and months. All the other switches and
buttons do what they are supposed to do. Using my 10526T logic pulser I can
force the minutes and hours counters to work. The power supply is in good
condition (after replacement of a few components) and I see no other
problems (yet).
Tracing the clock signal through the logic circuitry brought me to U3 on
the A4 board. This (U3) is a 4011 quad 2-input NAND gate in a 14-pin DIP
package. It "connects" the seconds counter to the minutes counter and
appears to have failed. One of the people on the email list
hp_agilent_equipment@yahoogroups.com commented that the 4000 series CMOS
chips have a known limited lifetime. Since these parts are no longer in
production, the writer expressed the concern that any parts I might find
to buy may be DOA.
Before I go hunting for parts, I'd appreciate hearing from anyone in the
group who has experience with the 59309A Clock and/or the 4000-series CMOS
family. In particular, are there modern equivalents to my 4011 chip? If
the 4000's really do have a limited lifetime I'd rather use a substitute.
Jeremy, N6WFO
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
A 4011 is an inexpensive part, Mouser still carries them, I would NOT buy a chinese part. Generally ESD mishandling is the cause of short component life
Content by Scott
Typos by Siri
On Apr 3, 2017, at 7:43 PM, Jeremy Nichols jn6wfo@gmail.com wrote:
I have a new-to-me HP-59309A HP-IB Digital Clock. The clock works on both the internal crystal oscillator and on an external 10 MHz standard (GPSDO). However, it counts only to 60 seconds and then repeats without updating the minutes digit. The TIME SET (FAST and SLOW) push-buttons work but again, the count will not update minutes and hours, only seconds. The DAY SET procedure works correctly for days and months. All the other switches and buttons do what they are supposed to do. Using my 10526T logic pulser I can force the minutes and hours counters to work. The power supply is in good condition (after replacement of a few components) and I see no other problems (yet).
Tracing the clock signal through the logic circuitry brought me to U3 on the A4 board. This (U3) is a 4011 quad 2-input NAND gate in a 14-pin DIP package. It "connects" the seconds counter to the minutes counter and appears to have failed. One of the people on the email list hp_agilent_equipment@yahoogroups.com commented that the 4000 series CMOS chips have a known limited lifetime. Since these parts are no longer in production, the writer expressed the concern that any parts I might find to buy may be DOA.
Before I go hunting for parts, I'd appreciate hearing from anyone in the group who has experience with the 59309A Clock and/or the 4000-series CMOS family. In particular, are there modern equivalents to my 4011 chip? If the 4000's really do have a limited lifetime I'd rather use a substitute.
Jeremy, N6WFO
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
The 14SO package is still in production, HEF4011B $0.37 ea from Digikey.
You should be able to get a breakout adapter if you need the DIP.
On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 7:43 PM, Jeremy Nichols jn6wfo@gmail.com wrote:
I have a new-to-me HP-59309A HP-IB Digital Clock. The clock works on both
the internal crystal oscillator and on an external 10 MHz standard (GPSDO).
However, it counts only to 60 seconds and then repeats without updating the
minutes digit. The TIME SET (FAST and SLOW) push-buttons work but again,
the count will not update minutes and hours, only seconds. The DAY SET
procedure works correctly for days and months. All the other switches and
buttons do what they are supposed to do. Using my 10526T logic pulser I can
force the minutes and hours counters to work. The power supply is in good
condition (after replacement of a few components) and I see no other
problems (yet).
Tracing the clock signal through the logic circuitry brought me to U3 on
the A4 board. This (U3) is a 4011 quad 2-input NAND gate in a 14-pin DIP
package. It "connects" the seconds counter to the minutes counter and
appears to have failed. One of the people on the email list <
hp_agilent_equipment@yahoogroups.com> commented that the 4000 series CMOS
chips have a known limited lifetime. Since these parts are no longer in
production, the writer expressed the concern that any parts I might find to
buy may be DOA.
Before I go hunting for parts, I'd appreciate hearing from anyone in the
group who has experience with the 59309A Clock and/or the 4000-series CMOS
family. In particular, are there modern equivalents to my 4011 chip? If the
4000's really do have a limited lifetime I'd rather use a substitute.
Jeremy, N6WFO
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/m
ailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
--
--Jim Harman
CMOS availability has held up pretty well because of its wide voltage
range. Mouser has over eleven thousand CD4011BE's in stock:
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Texas-Instruments/CD4011BE/
I can't rule out an old logic gate dying, but I would suspect this first:
Some clocks were made or modified to be tied to external minute and/or hour
synchronization pulses and these inputs can hold and jam zeroes into the
minute and hour counters.
Tim N3QE
On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 7:43 PM, Jeremy Nichols jn6wfo@gmail.com wrote:
I have a new-to-me HP-59309A HP-IB Digital Clock. The clock works on both
the internal crystal oscillator and on an external 10 MHz standard (GPSDO).
However, it counts only to 60 seconds and then repeats without updating the
minutes digit. The TIME SET (FAST and SLOW) push-buttons work but again,
the count will not update minutes and hours, only seconds. The DAY SET
procedure works correctly for days and months. All the other switches and
buttons do what they are supposed to do. Using my 10526T logic pulser I can
force the minutes and hours counters to work. The power supply is in good
condition (after replacement of a few components) and I see no other
problems (yet).
Tracing the clock signal through the logic circuitry brought me to U3 on
the A4 board. This (U3) is a 4011 quad 2-input NAND gate in a 14-pin DIP
package. It "connects" the seconds counter to the minutes counter and
appears to have failed. One of the people on the email list <
hp_agilent_equipment@yahoogroups.com> commented that the 4000 series CMOS
chips have a known limited lifetime. Since these parts are no longer in
production, the writer expressed the concern that any parts I might find to
buy may be DOA.
Before I go hunting for parts, I'd appreciate hearing from anyone in the
group who has experience with the 59309A Clock and/or the 4000-series CMOS
family. In particular, are there modern equivalents to my 4011 chip? If the
4000's really do have a limited lifetime I'd rather use a substitute.
Jeremy, N6WFO
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/m
ailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
Hi
A lot of the early IC’s were packaged in the era of “learning by doing”. The
net result is that some of them do indeed have process related packaging
“use by dates”. On top of that the early IC processes were not as fully
worked out as the more modern ones. Things like metallization thickness
turned out to be on the skimpy side in some cases. The other nail in the
coffin is input and output protection. The hazards of ESD and device upset
were not handled as rigorously early on. The net result is that depending on
any IC that dates back ~30 years is a bit of a gamble.
Bob
On Apr 3, 2017, at 7:43 PM, Jeremy Nichols jn6wfo@gmail.com wrote:
I have a new-to-me HP-59309A HP-IB Digital Clock. The clock works on both the internal crystal oscillator and on an external 10 MHz standard (GPSDO). However, it counts only to 60 seconds and then repeats without updating the minutes digit. The TIME SET (FAST and SLOW) push-buttons work but again, the count will not update minutes and hours, only seconds. The DAY SET procedure works correctly for days and months. All the other switches and buttons do what they are supposed to do. Using my 10526T logic pulser I can force the minutes and hours counters to work. The power supply is in good condition (after replacement of a few components) and I see no other problems (yet).
Tracing the clock signal through the logic circuitry brought me to U3 on the A4 board. This (U3) is a 4011 quad 2-input NAND gate in a 14-pin DIP package. It "connects" the seconds counter to the minutes counter and appears to have failed. One of the people on the email list hp_agilent_equipment@yahoogroups.com commented that the 4000 series CMOS chips have a known limited lifetime. Since these parts are no longer in production, the writer expressed the concern that any parts I might find to buy may be DOA.
Before I go hunting for parts, I'd appreciate hearing from anyone in the group who has experience with the 59309A Clock and/or the 4000-series CMOS family. In particular, are there modern equivalents to my 4011 chip? If the 4000's really do have a limited lifetime I'd rather use a substitute.
Jeremy, N6WFO
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
NOt pin-compatible but functional compatible and available is the 74C00
or74 HC00, which has a long life I am using one in my gate alarm
since1989, it is on all the time and the chip is available the HEF4011
is also available -- at Mouser -- it is pin-compatible and function
with CD4011 ad it is made by Philips [NXP]
73
KJ6UHN
Alex
On 4/3/2017 4:43 PM, Jeremy Nichols wrote:
I have a new-to-me HP-59309A HP-IB Digital Clock. The clock works on
both the internal crystal oscillator and on an external 10 MHz
standard (GPSDO). However, it counts only to 60 seconds and then
repeats without updating the minutes digit. The TIME SET (FAST and
SLOW) push-buttons work but again, the count will not update minutes
and hours, only seconds. The DAY SET procedure works correctly for
days and months. All the other switches and buttons do what they are
supposed to do. Using my 10526T logic pulser I can force the minutes
and hours counters to work. The power supply is in good condition
(after replacement of a few components) and I see no other problems
(yet).
Tracing the clock signal through the logic circuitry brought me to U3
on the A4 board. This (U3) is a 4011 quad 2-input NAND gate in a
14-pin DIP package. It "connects" the seconds counter to the minutes
counter and appears to have failed. One of the people on the email
list hp_agilent_equipment@yahoogroups.com commented that the 4000
series CMOS chips have a known limited lifetime. Since these parts are
no longer in production, the writer expressed the concern that any
parts I might find to buy may be DOA.
Before I go hunting for parts, I'd appreciate hearing from anyone in
the group who has experience with the 59309A Clock and/or the
4000-series CMOS family. In particular, are there modern equivalents
to my 4011 chip? If the 4000's really do have a limited lifetime I'd
rather use a substitute.
Jeremy, N6WFO
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.8012 / Virus Database: 4769/14231 - Release Date:
04/03/17
Also, you might install a high quality machined pin socket. Save the
non-replaceable PC board.
----- Original Message -----
From: "David C. Partridge" david.partridge@perdrix.co.uk
To: "'Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement'"
time-nuts@febo.com
Sent: Monday, April 03, 2017 9:33 PM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] HP-59309A Clock counts only seconds
You can get a brand new CD4011BE from pretty much most suppliers at about
15 cents that won't exhibit the problems of the earlier ones.
Dave
-----Original Message-----
From: time-nuts [mailto:time-nuts-bounces@febo.com] On Behalf Of Jeremy
Nichols
Sent: 04 April 2017 00:44
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Subject: [time-nuts] HP-59309A Clock counts only seconds
I have a new-to-me HP-59309A HP-IB Digital Clock. The clock works on both
the internal crystal oscillator and on an external 10 MHz standard
(GPSDO). However, it counts only to 60 seconds and then repeats without
updating the minutes digit. The TIME SET (FAST and SLOW) push-buttons work
but again, the count will not update minutes and hours, only seconds. The
DAY SET procedure works correctly for days and months. All the other
switches and buttons do what they are supposed to do. Using my 10526T
logic pulser I can force the minutes and hours counters to work.
The power supply is in good condition (after replacement of a few
components) and I see no other problems (yet).
Tracing the clock signal through the logic circuitry brought me to U3 on
the A4 board. This (U3) is a 4011 quad 2-input NAND gate in a 14-pin DIP
package. It "connects" the seconds counter to the minutes counter and
appears to have failed. One of the people on the email list
hp_agilent_equipment@yahoogroups.com commented that the 4000 series CMOS
chips have a known limited lifetime. Since these parts are no longer in
production, the writer expressed the concern that any parts I might find
to buy may be DOA.
Before I go hunting for parts, I'd appreciate hearing from anyone in the
group who has experience with the 59309A Clock and/or the 4000-series CMOS
family. In particular, are there modern equivalents to my 4011 chip? If
the 4000's really do have a limited lifetime I'd rather use a substitute.
Jeremy, N6WFO
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to
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and follow the instructions there.
Thanks, everyone, for your inputs. I've ordered some NOS 4011s (made by
National Semi, mildly ironic since I used to work there) and some
supposedly round pin sockets (the reviews were mixed—some folks got good
stuff, some got junk).
I'll update the thread once I have everything here and installed.
Jeremy
On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 11:01 PM Tom Miller tmiller11147@verizon.net wrote:
Also, you might install a high quality machined pin socket. Save the
non-replaceable PC board.
----- Original Message -----
From: "David C. Partridge" david.partridge@perdrix.co.uk
To: "'Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement'"
time-nuts@febo.com
Sent: Monday, April 03, 2017 9:33 PM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] HP-59309A Clock counts only seconds
You can get a brand new CD4011BE from pretty much most suppliers at about
15 cents that won't exhibit the problems of the earlier ones.
Dave
-----Original Message-----
From: time-nuts [mailto:time-nuts-bounces@febo.com] On Behalf Of Jeremy
Nichols
Sent: 04 April 2017 00:44
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Subject: [time-nuts] HP-59309A Clock counts only seconds
I have a new-to-me HP-59309A HP-IB Digital Clock. The clock works on both
the internal crystal oscillator and on an external 10 MHz standard
(GPSDO). However, it counts only to 60 seconds and then repeats without
updating the minutes digit. The TIME SET (FAST and SLOW) push-buttons
work
but again, the count will not update minutes and hours, only seconds. The
DAY SET procedure works correctly for days and months. All the other
switches and buttons do what they are supposed to do. Using my 10526T
logic pulser I can force the minutes and hours counters to work.
The power supply is in good condition (after replacement of a few
components) and I see no other problems (yet).
Tracing the clock signal through the logic circuitry brought me to U3 on
the A4 board. This (U3) is a 4011 quad 2-input NAND gate in a 14-pin DIP
package. It "connects" the seconds counter to the minutes counter and
appears to have failed. One of the people on the email list
hp_agilent_equipment@yahoogroups.com commented that the 4000 series
CMOS
chips have a known limited lifetime. Since these parts are no longer in
production, the writer expressed the concern that any parts I might find
to buy may be DOA.
Before I go hunting for parts, I'd appreciate hearing from anyone in the
group who has experience with the 59309A Clock and/or the 4000-series
CMOS
family. In particular, are there modern equivalents to my 4011 chip? If
the 4000's really do have a limited lifetime I'd rather use a substitute.
Jeremy, N6WFO
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to
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