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Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement

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Re: [time-nuts] Man with too many clocks.

HM
Hal Murray
Fri, Nov 4, 2016 7:34 PM

The only practical way to set the 10811 or 10544 is with a >= 10 turn pot on
the EFC. I never have worked out just why there are so many instruments that
don’t have a pot on the EFC.

How would temperature effect that?  For that matter, how does temperature
effect the typical mechanical capacitor?  Does anybody play fancy tricks to
cancel out the mechanical motions?  (like the mercury pendulum - as the
pendulum rod expands the mercury expands in the other direction to keep the
CG the same)

--
These are my opinions.  I hate spam.

kb8tq@n1k.org said: > The only practical way to set the 10811 or 10544 is with a >= 10 turn pot on > the EFC. I never have worked out just why there are so many instruments that > don’t have a pot on the EFC. How would temperature effect that? For that matter, how does temperature effect the typical mechanical capacitor? Does anybody play fancy tricks to cancel out the mechanical motions? (like the mercury pendulum - as the pendulum rod expands the mercury expands in the other direction to keep the CG the same) -- These are my opinions. I hate spam.
W
Wes
Fri, Nov 4, 2016 8:35 PM

On 11/4/2016 12:34 PM, Hal Murray wrote:

The only practical way to set the 10811 or 10544 is with a >= 10 turn pot on
the EFC. I never have worked out just why there are so many instruments that
don’t have a pot on the EFC.

How would temperature effect that?  For that matter, how does temperature
effect the typical mechanical capacitor?  Does anybody play fancy tricks to
cancel out the mechanical motions?  (like the mercury pendulum - as the
pendulum rod expands the mercury expands in the other direction to keep the
CG the same)

The variable tuning capacitor in one of the military "frequency meters" (I
forget which one, BC221 leaps to mind) had a small disk on an adjustment screw
that worked against a bi-metallic strip "diving board" to make a temperature
sensitive trimmer capacitor.  I suspect, however, that it functioned more to
compensate the inductor than the variable capacitor that was very robust.

Before synthesizers, I built a VFO for a homemade receiver using one of these
cannibalized from a freq meter.

Wes Stewart, N7WS

On 11/4/2016 12:34 PM, Hal Murray wrote: > kb8tq@n1k.org said: >> The only practical way to set the 10811 or 10544 is with a >= 10 turn pot on >> the EFC. I never have worked out just why there are so many instruments that >> don’t have a pot on the EFC. > How would temperature effect that? For that matter, how does temperature > effect the typical mechanical capacitor? Does anybody play fancy tricks to > cancel out the mechanical motions? (like the mercury pendulum - as the > pendulum rod expands the mercury expands in the other direction to keep the > CG the same) > The variable tuning capacitor in one of the military "frequency meters" (I forget which one, BC221 leaps to mind) had a small disk on an adjustment screw that worked against a bi-metallic strip "diving board" to make a temperature sensitive trimmer capacitor. I suspect, however, that it functioned more to compensate the inductor than the variable capacitor that was very robust. Before synthesizers, I built a VFO for a homemade receiver using one of these cannibalized from a freq meter. Wes Stewart, N7WS
W
Wes
Fri, Nov 4, 2016 9:05 PM

On 11/4/2016 1:35 PM, Wes wrote:

Before synthesizers, I built a VFO for a homemade receiver using one of these
cannibalized from a freq meter.

Wes Stewart, N7WS

I guess this list allows attachments so here are some photos.

VFO_1.jpg shows an overall view.  There are two trimmers seen on the end frame
that line up with the holes in the cover.

VFO_2.jpg is another view with the temperature compensating trimmer just visible
behind the circuit card.

VFO_2a.jpg is a closer view.

On 11/4/2016 1:35 PM, Wes wrote: > > Before synthesizers, I built a VFO for a homemade receiver using one of these > cannibalized from a freq meter. > > Wes Stewart, N7WS I guess this list allows attachments so here are some photos. VFO_1.jpg shows an overall view. There are two trimmers seen on the end frame that line up with the holes in the cover. VFO_2.jpg is another view with the temperature compensating trimmer just visible behind the circuit card. VFO_2a.jpg is a closer view.
BC
Bob Camp
Sat, Nov 5, 2016 12:01 PM

HI

If you use a good wire wound pot and run it off of and oscillator EFC source (not
all have them), the temperature effect is pretty much zero. You are using the pot
as a ratio device.

A mechanical cap that is part of the heated region of the OCXO (the normal case)
has already been taken into consideration when the OCXO set point is adjusted to
compensate it.

Bob

On Nov 4, 2016, at 3:34 PM, Hal Murray hmurray@megapathdsl.net wrote:

kb8tq@n1k.org said:

The only practical way to set the 10811 or 10544 is with a >= 10 turn pot on
the EFC. I never have worked out just why there are so many instruments that
don’t have a pot on the EFC.

How would temperature effect that?  For that matter, how does temperature
effect the typical mechanical capacitor?  Does anybody play fancy tricks to
cancel out the mechanical motions?  (like the mercury pendulum - as the
pendulum rod expands the mercury expands in the other direction to keep the
CG the same)

--
These are my opinions.  I hate spam.


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HI If you use a good wire wound pot and run it off of and oscillator EFC source (not all have them), the temperature effect is pretty much zero. You are using the pot as a ratio device. A mechanical cap that is part of the heated region of the OCXO (the normal case) has already been taken into consideration when the OCXO set point is adjusted to compensate it. Bob > On Nov 4, 2016, at 3:34 PM, Hal Murray <hmurray@megapathdsl.net> wrote: > > > kb8tq@n1k.org said: >> The only practical way to set the 10811 or 10544 is with a >= 10 turn pot on >> the EFC. I never have worked out just why there are so many instruments that >> don’t have a pot on the EFC. > > How would temperature effect that? For that matter, how does temperature > effect the typical mechanical capacitor? Does anybody play fancy tricks to > cancel out the mechanical motions? (like the mercury pendulum - as the > pendulum rod expands the mercury expands in the other direction to keep the > CG the same) > > -- > These are my opinions. I hate spam. > > > > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there.