OT: ExpressPCB (cross-post from volts-nuts)
Sorry if I'm behind the times, just did a new project that required a
pcb, and ExpressPCB is my go-to vendor for one-off boards. I just
noticed they now provide the low-cost boards (fixed size, 3x5, quantity
3) that I've always ordered with silk screen and solder mask for $71. I
got my latest boards that way and they're beautiful. No relationship to
them, just a happy customer. You can still get the barebones boards for
$51. The hack I used to use was to put the component id and such on the
top copper layer as tiny text, but that was a bit of a pain for layout.
(Oops, can't put that label there, it's copper and there's a trace there
also) Really nice to be able to get real boards, even if it does end up
being ~$23/board.
--
Bill Ezell
The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck
will be the day they make vacuum cleaners.
Or maybe Windows 10.
On 9 December 2016 at 19:58, BIll Ezell wje@quackers.net wrote:
Sorry if I'm behind the times, just did a new project that required a pcb,
and ExpressPCB is my go-to vendor for one-off boards. I just noticed they
now provide the low-cost boards (fixed size, 3x5, quantity 3) that I've
always ordered with silk screen and solder mask for $71. I got my latest
boards that way and they're beautiful. No relationship to them, just a happy
customer. You can still get the barebones boards for $51.
You also lock yourself into one vendor. There's other free software,
like Kicad, where you can export files that many PCB manufacturers
use. So you avoid vendor lock-in.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vendor_lock-in
If the company goes belly up, where are you going to get any more
boards made, without starting from scratch?
Anyway, it is a bit off topic.
Dave
Hi
The bottom line has always been that the outfits in China are the cheaper source for boards.
That said, right now, Advanced Circuits will sell you a single piece of a double sided board
for $33. It’s a “full feature” board with solder mask, silk screen, and a 3 day fab time. I don’t
use their free software, but have always been quite happy with their boards.
Bob
On Dec 9, 2016, at 2:58 PM, BIll Ezell wje@quackers.net wrote:
Sorry if I'm behind the times, just did a new project that required a pcb, and ExpressPCB is my go-to vendor for one-off boards. I just noticed they now provide the low-cost boards (fixed size, 3x5, quantity 3) that I've always ordered with silk screen and solder mask for $71. I got my latest boards that way and they're beautiful. No relationship to them, just a happy customer. You can still get the barebones boards for $51. The hack I used to use was to put the component id and such on the top copper layer as tiny text, but that was a bit of a pain for layout. (Oops, can't put that label there, it's copper and there's a trace there also) Really nice to be able to get real boards, even if it does end up being ~$23/board.
--
Bill Ezell
The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck
will be the day they make vacuum cleaners.
Or maybe Windows 10.
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
I built my first set of boards with ExpressPCB, but they get expensive quickly if you want to make something that's not in their special form factor. I use KICAD and OshPark.com to make my boards (there are other board makers). I just ordered some boards that are .7" x .63" that cost $8.40 for 12. You buy in multiples of 3, so that was actually $2.10 for a set of 3 times 4 sets. Using surface mount, I was able to put an SOIC-14, an SOIC-16, an SOT23-5, three 0805 caps, a 3 pin header, and a 5 pad connector on the board. Something like that would be wastefully expensive on ExpressPCB.
Bob
From: BIll Ezell <wje@quackers.net>
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 1:58 PM
Subject: [time-nuts] OT: ExpressPCB (cross-post from volts-nuts)
Sorry if I'm behind the times, just did a new project that required a
pcb, and ExpressPCB is my go-to vendor for one-off boards. I just
noticed they now provide the low-cost boards (fixed size, 3x5, quantity
3) that I've always ordered with silk screen and solder mask for $71. I
got my latest boards that way and they're beautiful. No relationship to
them, just a happy customer. You can still get the barebones boards for
$51. The hack I used to use was to put the component id and such on the
top copper layer as tiny text, but that was a bit of a pain for layout.
(Oops, can't put that label there, it's copper and there's a trace there
also) Really nice to be able to get real boards, even if it does end up
being ~$23/board.
--
Bill Ezell
The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck
will be the day they make vacuum cleaners.
Or maybe Windows 10.
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
Hi Bill:
It's their Mini Board Pro service and you get 3 each 2-layer boards each 3.8 x 2.5" with solder mask (great for SMT) and
silk screen top side labels for $61.
https://www.expresspcb.com/miniboard-pro/
If you get this service some caution is needed regarding the solder mask since it's possible to have the mask where you
were expecting to see metal.
Also note they have free schematic software that can be used to check the nodes on the board layout.
--
Have Fun,
Brooke Clarke
http://www.PRC68.com
http://www.end2partygovernment.com/2012Issues.html
The lesser of evils is still evil.
-------- Original Message --------
Sorry if I'm behind the times, just did a new project that required a pcb, and ExpressPCB is my go-to vendor for
one-off boards. I just noticed they now provide the low-cost boards (fixed size, 3x5, quantity 3) that I've always
ordered with silk screen and solder mask for $71. I got my latest boards that way and they're beautiful. No
relationship to them, just a happy customer. You can still get the barebones boards for $51. The hack I used to use
was to put the component id and such on the top copper layer as tiny text, but that was a bit of a pain for layout.
(Oops, can't put that label there, it's copper and there's a trace there also) Really nice to be able to get real
boards, even if it does end up being ~$23/board.
That points out a key difference in the PCB house pricing models:
ExpressPCB and the Advanced Circuits $33 prototype are flat fee up to a
size limit (for Advanced Circuits 4 x 6 inches) while others go by the
square inch -- OSH Park is $5/in2 for three copies of two layer, and
$10/in2 for three of four layer.
So for small boards, OSH Park is great but for larger boards, the price
difference reduces (a 4 x 6 board ends up being just about the same
price as Advanced Circuits). And if you can stand the slower
turnaround, the Chinese board houses can't be beat for any size.
John
On 12/9/2016 3:18 PM, Bob Stewart wrote:
I built my first set of boards with ExpressPCB, but they get expensive quickly if you want to make something that's not in their special form factor. I use KICAD and OshPark.com to make my boards (there are other board makers). I just ordered some boards that are .7" x .63" that cost $8.40 for 12. You buy in multiples of 3, so that was actually $2.10 for a set of 3 times 4 sets. Using surface mount, I was able to put an SOIC-14, an SOIC-16, an SOT23-5, three 0805 caps, a 3 pin header, and a 5 pad connector on the board. Something like that would be wastefully expensive on ExpressPCB.
Bob
From: BIll Ezell <wje@quackers.net>
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 1:58 PM
Subject: [time-nuts] OT: ExpressPCB (cross-post from volts-nuts)
Sorry if I'm behind the times, just did a new project that required a
pcb, and ExpressPCB is my go-to vendor for one-off boards. I just
noticed they now provide the low-cost boards (fixed size, 3x5, quantity
3) that I've always ordered with silk screen and solder mask for $71. I
got my latest boards that way and they're beautiful. No relationship to
them, just a happy customer. You can still get the barebones boards for
$51. The hack I used to use was to put the component id and such on the
top copper layer as tiny text, but that was a bit of a pain for layout.
(Oops, can't put that label there, it's copper and there's a trace there
also) Really nice to be able to get real boards, even if it does end up
being ~$23/board.
Hi
If you are one of those people who feel “cramped” in anything less than 6 layers, the Chinese
are about the only way to go. There are a few houses over there that will do 6 and 8 layer
boards at a “basement affordable” sort of price. Given the way things change with some of
these outfits figuring out who is doing this or that (and doing it right) can be a major chore.
In some cases the right answer last month is not the right answer this month …..
Bob
On Dec 9, 2016, at 3:34 PM, John Ackermann N8UR jra@febo.com wrote:
That points out a key difference in the PCB house pricing models: ExpressPCB and the Advanced Circuits $33 prototype are flat fee up to a size limit (for Advanced Circuits 4 x 6 inches) while others go by the square inch -- OSH Park is $5/in2 for three copies of two layer, and $10/in2 for three of four layer.
So for small boards, OSH Park is great but for larger boards, the price difference reduces (a 4 x 6 board ends up being just about the same price as Advanced Circuits). And if you can stand the slower turnaround, the Chinese board houses can't be beat for any size.
John
On 12/9/2016 3:18 PM, Bob Stewart wrote:
I built my first set of boards with ExpressPCB, but they get expensive quickly if you want to make something that's not in their special form factor. I use KICAD and OshPark.com to make my boards (there are other board makers). I just ordered some boards that are .7" x .63" that cost $8.40 for 12. You buy in multiples of 3, so that was actually $2.10 for a set of 3 times 4 sets. Using surface mount, I was able to put an SOIC-14, an SOIC-16, an SOT23-5, three 0805 caps, a 3 pin header, and a 5 pad connector on the board. Something like that would be wastefully expensive on ExpressPCB.
Bob
From: BIll Ezell <wje@quackers.net>
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 1:58 PM
Subject: [time-nuts] OT: ExpressPCB (cross-post from volts-nuts)
Sorry if I'm behind the times, just did a new project that required a
pcb, and ExpressPCB is my go-to vendor for one-off boards. I just
noticed they now provide the low-cost boards (fixed size, 3x5, quantity
3) that I've always ordered with silk screen and solder mask for $71. I
got my latest boards that way and they're beautiful. No relationship to
them, just a happy customer. You can still get the barebones boards for
$51. The hack I used to use was to put the component id and such on the
top copper layer as tiny text, but that was a bit of a pain for layout.
(Oops, can't put that label there, it's copper and there's a trace there
also) Really nice to be able to get real boards, even if it does end up
being ~$23/board.
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
Hi John:
Yes. It is not at all economical to have ExpressPCB make boards the final size in production. BUT . . . if you have
them make panels and cut them apart yourself it's very reasonable. I've used many methods for cutting the boards apart
but have settled on a 12" metal shear that cuts them as easy as cutting butter.
http://www.prc68.com/I/12InShear.shtml
There is a limit on the number of holes so you can not use holes as a way to snapping panels into individual boards.
Note the largest boards they make are 12 x 14".
They are in Portland, USA.
I think they are charging 34 cents/sqin (5-day) plus other charges on a per order and per board basis. For example:
https://www.expresspcb.com/production-service/
--
Have Fun,
Brooke Clarke
http://www.PRC68.com
http://www.end2partygovernment.com/2012Issues.html
The lesser of evils is still evil.
-------- Original Message --------
That points out a key difference in the PCB house pricing models: ExpressPCB and the Advanced Circuits $33 prototype
are flat fee up to a size limit (for Advanced Circuits 4 x 6 inches) while others go by the square inch -- OSH Park is
$5/in2 for three copies of two layer, and $10/in2 for three of four layer.
So for small boards, OSH Park is great but for larger boards, the price difference reduces (a 4 x 6 board ends up
being just about the same price as Advanced Circuits). And if you can stand the slower turnaround, the Chinese board
houses can't be beat for any size.
John
On 12/9/2016 3:18 PM, Bob Stewart wrote:
I built my first set of boards with ExpressPCB, but they get expensive quickly if you want to make something that's
not in their special form factor. I use KICAD and OshPark.com to make my boards (there are other board makers). I
just ordered some boards that are .7" x .63" that cost $8.40 for 12. You buy in multiples of 3, so that was actually
$2.10 for a set of 3 times 4 sets. Using surface mount, I was able to put an SOIC-14, an SOIC-16, an SOT23-5, three
0805 caps, a 3 pin header, and a 5 pad connector on the board. Something like that would be wastefully expensive on
ExpressPCB.
Bob
From: BIll Ezell <wje@quackers.net>
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 1:58 PM
Subject: [time-nuts] OT: ExpressPCB (cross-post from volts-nuts)
Sorry if I'm behind the times, just did a new project that required a
pcb, and ExpressPCB is my go-to vendor for one-off boards. I just
noticed they now provide the low-cost boards (fixed size, 3x5, quantity
3) that I've always ordered with silk screen and solder mask for $71. I
got my latest boards that way and they're beautiful. No relationship to
them, just a happy customer. You can still get the barebones boards for
$51. The hack I used to use was to put the component id and such on the
top copper layer as tiny text, but that was a bit of a pain for layout.
(Oops, can't put that label there, it's copper and there's a trace there
also) Really nice to be able to get real boards, even if it does end up
being ~$23/board.
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.
On 12/9/16 1:02 PM, Brooke Clarke wrote:
Hi John:
Yes. It is not at all economical to have ExpressPCB make boards the
final size in production. BUT . .
I've used Sunstone (also known as PCBExpress, which is a bit confusing).
both ExpressPCB and Sunstone also have deals with Screaming Circuits,
who I've also used.
Sunstone (like other places) can turn 2,4,6 layer boards around in a
day, if you need it. They can do up to 14 layers, although I've never
used them for this, and I'll bet the lead time is a bit more
They can also do boards on Rogers materials, if you're doing microwave
stuff.
There's a sort of hotbed of these quick turn firms up in Oregon.. I
don't know why.
+1 on Sunstone
+1 on Screaming Circuits, who will SMT the board with consigned parts or
even do a full turnkey build. Been happy with them on both accounts.
I don't know how many of these super cheap places will do full electrical
check -- I want it on my personal boards.
On Fri, Dec 9, 2016 at 1:22 PM, jimlux jimlux@earthlink.net wrote:
On 12/9/16 1:02 PM, Brooke Clarke wrote:
Hi John:
Yes. It is not at all economical to have ExpressPCB make boards the
final size in production. BUT . .
I've used Sunstone (also known as PCBExpress, which is a bit confusing).
both ExpressPCB and Sunstone also have deals with Screaming Circuits, who
I've also used.
Sunstone (like other places) can turn 2,4,6 layer boards around in a day,
if you need it. They can do up to 14 layers, although I've never used them
for this, and I'll bet the lead time is a bit more
They can also do boards on Rogers materials, if you're doing microwave
stuff.
There's a sort of hotbed of these quick turn firms up in Oregon.. I don't
know why.
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/m
ailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.