Anyone have a spare cable for the Lucent setup? I guess I can make one with some DB15 connectors but trying to skip the effort. Thanks Jerry

I need to make one, is there a schematic of the interface available? Dave Thompson > On Nov 13, 2017, at 22:50, Jerry Hancock <jerry@hanler.com> wrote: > > Anyone have a spare cable for the Lucent setup? I guess I can make one with some DB15 connectors but trying to skip the effort. > > Thanks > > Jerry > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there.

Yes, the cable is pretty easy, basically DB15 pin 1 to 15; 2-14; 3-13; 4-12; 5-11; 6-10; 7-9 and 8 to 8 followed by 9-7; 10-6; 11-5; 12-4; 13-3; 14-2; 15-1. If you do a search for "Lucent RFTG-U" and look around on time-nuts you will find it laid-out in a little more detail. I was just looking again and it always takes some screwing around to find it. If all else fails, send me a note and I’ll dig it up when I go to make mine. This will be my second set of the units. They just seem to hum along since I’ve had them 18 months. I use a passive outboard distribution unit and can easily drive 16 devices. Regards, Jerry > On Nov 13, 2017, at 8:50 PM, Jerry Hancock <jerry@hanler.com> wrote: > > Anyone have a spare cable for the Lucent setup? I guess I can make one with some DB15 connectors but trying to skip the effort. > > Thanks > > Jerry > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there.

Hi If you are going to get out the soldering iron, why simply make up a plug to run the GPS unit stand alone? Keep the second unit powered down as a set of spare parts….. Yes, it does depend a bit on what you are doing with them …. Bob > On Nov 13, 2017, at 11:50 PM, Jerry Hancock <jerry@hanler.com> wrote: > > Anyone have a spare cable for the Lucent setup? I guess I can make one with some DB15 connectors but trying to skip the effort. > > Thanks > > Jerry > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there.

Bob, I thought you had to send it code, etc? I have the two units with cable, etc running upstairs. I want another one for in my office but the same guy only sells the REF0 and REF1 units separately now without the cable. I thought about splitting the two and using this other GPS unit I have (it was one of the TAPR GPS Kits) to send the other one the 1pps. You’re saying all you need is a plug? I would need two functioning units. Regards, Jerry Jerry Hancock jerry@hanler.com (415) 215-3779 > On Nov 14, 2017, at 8:13 AM, Bob Camp <kb8tq@n1k.org> wrote: > > Hi > > If you are going to get out the soldering iron, why simply make up a plug > to run the GPS unit stand alone? Keep the second unit powered down > as a set of spare parts….. Yes, it does depend a bit on what you are doing > with them …. > > Bob > >> On Nov 13, 2017, at 11:50 PM, Jerry Hancock <jerry@hanler.com> wrote: >> >> Anyone have a spare cable for the Lucent setup? I guess I can make one with some DB15 connectors but trying to skip the effort. >> >> Thanks >> >> Jerry >> _______________________________________________ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. > > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there.

Hi Just going by memory (never a good thing ….); You can make the GPS unit believe that it has a “slave” present *and* that the slave is not working properly. It’s all done with logic levels. In the “slave down” mode, the unit with the GPS puts out the 15 MHz and all the messages. The thing you loose is the (dirty) 10 MHz output from the slave. Bob > On Nov 14, 2017, at 11:30 AM, Jerry Hancock <jerry@hanler.com> wrote: > > Bob, I thought you had to send it code, etc? I have the two units with cable, etc running upstairs. I want another one for in my office but the same guy only sells the REF0 and REF1 units separately now without the cable. I thought about splitting the two and using this other GPS unit I have (it was one of the TAPR GPS Kits) to send the other one the 1pps. You’re saying all you need is a plug? I would need two functioning units. > > Regards, > > Jerry > > > Jerry Hancock > jerry@hanler.com > (415) 215-3779 > >> On Nov 14, 2017, at 8:13 AM, Bob Camp <kb8tq@n1k.org> wrote: >> >> Hi >> >> If you are going to get out the soldering iron, why simply make up a plug >> to run the GPS unit stand alone? Keep the second unit powered down >> as a set of spare parts….. Yes, it does depend a bit on what you are doing >> with them …. >> >> Bob >> >>> On Nov 13, 2017, at 11:50 PM, Jerry Hancock <jerry@hanler.com> wrote: >>> >>> Anyone have a spare cable for the Lucent setup? I guess I can make one with some DB15 connectors but trying to skip the effort. >>> >>> Thanks >>> >>> Jerry >>> _______________________________________________ >>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>> and follow the instructions there. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. > > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there.

Hi Jerry, the 15 MHz is disabled by default, just bridging some pins enables the output: http://syncchannel.blogspot.se/2015/11/denuo-gps-hits-rev-b-dongles.html If you want to insert some 1PPS signal to discipline it, you need some fake some GPS messages. Dan has done some nice work here, a small ATTiny is sufficient. /Thomas, SA6CID On Tue, Nov 14, 2017 at 08:30:54AM -0800, Jerry Hancock wrote: > Bob, I thought you had to send it code, etc? I have the two units > with cable, etc running upstairs. I want another one for in my office > but the same guy only sells the REF0 and REF1 units separately now > without the cable. I thought about splitting the two and using this > other GPS unit I have (it was one of the TAPR GPS Kits) to send the > other one the 1pps. You’re saying all you need is a plug? I would > need two functioning units. > > Regards, > > Jerry > > > Jerry Hancock > jerry@hanler.com > (415) 215-3779 > > > On Nov 14, 2017, at 8:13 AM, Bob Camp <kb8tq@n1k.org> wrote: > > > > Hi > > > > If you are going to get out the soldering iron, why simply make up a plug > > to run the GPS unit stand alone? Keep the second unit powered down > > as a set of spare parts….. Yes, it does depend a bit on what you are doing > > with them …. > > > > Bob > > > >> On Nov 13, 2017, at 11:50 PM, Jerry Hancock <jerry@hanler.com> wrote: > >> > >> Anyone have a spare cable for the Lucent setup? I guess I can make one with some DB15 connectors but trying to skip the effort. > >> > >> Thanks > >> > >> Jerry > >> _______________________________________________ > >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > >> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > >> and follow the instructions there. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > > and follow the instructions there. > > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. >

Thomas, Yes, thank you, I read the work Dan posted. I have this TAPR GPS with the M12+ board in it that I received for free after machining the end plates and the unused standby REF0 or REF1, can’t remember which has the GPS in it. I would like to have another 10Mhz standard in my office. I also have an OCXO out of my Tektronix 11301 I was given but that uses a trimmer that I can’t really mod to discipline so that option of GPS + OCXO is out. So I wouldn’t mind figuring out a way to take the TAPR GPS and feed it into the spare REF unit not unlike what the other REF unit is doing. I would then have to fake some data per Dan’s site. Having written this, I just might do this project now that I think about it. I could then also use an STM32F7 board with display to post a clock as well. I guess I would also have to tap off the (debatably dirty) 10Mhz signal internally in the one that is missing. I’m going to go back and reread Dan’s paper. There were questions about the sawtooth IIRC and I remember seeing it when I compared the output of the TAPR 1PPS vs the Lucent 1PPS as they would jump phase by successive increments and then bounce back. I don’t think we ever determined which one was moving but I remember someone telling me it was most likely related to a sawtooth in the discipline. I don’t know enough about these things to say for sure, but watching the 1PPS vs the other made me start to wonder about the absolute phase accuracy of those signals. You would have thought they would have been perfectly in phase, no? I go to bed at night with the confidence that the free TAPR GPS is the culprit vs my Lucent that which cost me $200 when all done. So in summary, I have to plug the GPS REF unit, tap-off the 10Mhz someplace on one or the other, feed the second REF unit with my TPAR GPS then also send it some text (which is known by Dan) and I should get a second disciplined 10Mhz unit. This will take me a few weeks during which I will get bored and forget why I was doing it in the first place. So please remind me when I post back. Jerry > On Nov 14, 2017, at 8:50 AM, Thomas Petig <thomas@petig.eu> wrote: > > Hi Jerry, > the 15 MHz is disabled by default, just bridging some pins enables the > output: > http://syncchannel.blogspot.se/2015/11/denuo-gps-hits-rev-b-dongles.html > > If you want to insert some 1PPS signal to discipline it, you need some > fake some GPS messages. Dan has done some nice work here, a small ATTiny > is sufficient. > > /Thomas, SA6CID > > > On Tue, Nov 14, 2017 at 08:30:54AM -0800, Jerry Hancock wrote: >> Bob, I thought you had to send it code, etc? I have the two units >> with cable, etc running upstairs. I want another one for in my office >> but the same guy only sells the REF0 and REF1 units separately now >> without the cable. I thought about splitting the two and using this >> other GPS unit I have (it was one of the TAPR GPS Kits) to send the >> other one the 1pps. You’re saying all you need is a plug? I would >> need two functioning units. >> >> Regards, >> >> Jerry >> >> >> Jerry Hancock >> jerry@hanler.com >> (415) 215-3779 >> >>> On Nov 14, 2017, at 8:13 AM, Bob Camp <kb8tq@n1k.org> wrote: >>> >>> Hi >>> >>> If you are going to get out the soldering iron, why simply make up a plug >>> to run the GPS unit stand alone? Keep the second unit powered down >>> as a set of spare parts….. Yes, it does depend a bit on what you are doing >>> with them …. >>> >>> Bob >>> >>>> On Nov 13, 2017, at 11:50 PM, Jerry Hancock <jerry@hanler.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> Anyone have a spare cable for the Lucent setup? I guess I can make one with some DB15 connectors but trying to skip the effort. >>>> >>>> Thanks >>>> >>>> Jerry >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>>> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>>> and follow the instructions there. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>> and follow the instructions there. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. >> > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there.

Hi If you compare the PPS output of a simple GPS module (any of them) to a properly functioning GPSDO, you will see jumps in the module output. They are a function of the way all of the modules quantize the PPS signal. For higher resolution on the PPS you would have to use the sawtooth correction message to somehow modify the PPS signal. Some GPSDO’s slip phase on the PPS as part of the alignment process so you can never say that there are only jumps in a bare module. GPSDO’s also steer frequency to keep the PPS aligned. The damping (lag) in this process results in errors both in frequency and in the PPS edge. So, none of it is perfect (this is Time Nuts …). All of it has “issues” if you look close enough. A Frequency Nut would complain about some things and a Time (only) Nut wold complain about others. That’s not true in an absolute sense, but it is true in terms of what each would optimize for on a real world device. Bob > On Nov 14, 2017, at 12:55 PM, Jerry Hancock <jerry@hanler.com> wrote: > > Thomas, Yes, thank you, I read the work Dan posted. > > I have this TAPR GPS with the M12+ board in it that I received for free after machining the end plates and the unused standby REF0 or REF1, can’t remember which has the GPS in it. I would like to have another 10Mhz standard in my office. I also have an OCXO out of my Tektronix 11301 I was given but that uses a trimmer that I can’t really mod to discipline so that option of GPS + OCXO is out. So I wouldn’t mind figuring out a way to take the TAPR GPS and feed it into the spare REF unit not unlike what the other REF unit is doing. I would then have to fake some data per Dan’s site. Having written this, I just might do this project now that I think about it. I could then also use an STM32F7 board with display to post a clock as well. I guess I would also have to tap off the (debatably dirty) 10Mhz signal internally in the one that is missing. > > I’m going to go back and reread Dan’s paper. There were questions about the sawtooth IIRC and I remember seeing it when I compared the output of the TAPR 1PPS vs the Lucent 1PPS as they would jump phase by successive increments and then bounce back. I don’t think we ever determined which one was moving but I remember someone telling me it was most likely related to a sawtooth in the discipline. I don’t know enough about these things to say for sure, but watching the 1PPS vs the other made me start to wonder about the absolute phase accuracy of those signals. You would have thought they would have been perfectly in phase, no? I go to bed at night with the confidence that the free TAPR GPS is the culprit vs my Lucent that which cost me $200 when all done. > > So in summary, I have to plug the GPS REF unit, tap-off the 10Mhz someplace on one or the other, feed the second REF unit with my TPAR GPS then also send it some text (which is known by Dan) and I should get a second disciplined 10Mhz unit. This will take me a few weeks during which I will get bored and forget why I was doing it in the first place. So please remind me when I post back. > > Jerry > > >> On Nov 14, 2017, at 8:50 AM, Thomas Petig <thomas@petig.eu> wrote: >> >> Hi Jerry, >> the 15 MHz is disabled by default, just bridging some pins enables the >> output: >> http://syncchannel.blogspot.se/2015/11/denuo-gps-hits-rev-b-dongles.html >> >> If you want to insert some 1PPS signal to discipline it, you need some >> fake some GPS messages. Dan has done some nice work here, a small ATTiny >> is sufficient. >> >> /Thomas, SA6CID >> >> >> On Tue, Nov 14, 2017 at 08:30:54AM -0800, Jerry Hancock wrote: >>> Bob, I thought you had to send it code, etc? I have the two units >>> with cable, etc running upstairs. I want another one for in my office >>> but the same guy only sells the REF0 and REF1 units separately now >>> without the cable. I thought about splitting the two and using this >>> other GPS unit I have (it was one of the TAPR GPS Kits) to send the >>> other one the 1pps. You’re saying all you need is a plug? I would >>> need two functioning units. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Jerry >>> >>> >>> Jerry Hancock >>> jerry@hanler.com >>> (415) 215-3779 >>> >>>> On Nov 14, 2017, at 8:13 AM, Bob Camp <kb8tq@n1k.org> wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi >>>> >>>> If you are going to get out the soldering iron, why simply make up a plug >>>> to run the GPS unit stand alone? Keep the second unit powered down >>>> as a set of spare parts….. Yes, it does depend a bit on what you are doing >>>> with them …. >>>> >>>> Bob >>>> >>>>> On Nov 13, 2017, at 11:50 PM, Jerry Hancock <jerry@hanler.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Anyone have a spare cable for the Lucent setup? I guess I can make one with some DB15 connectors but trying to skip the effort. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks >>>>> >>>>> Jerry >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>>>> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>>>> and follow the instructions there. >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>>> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>>> and follow the instructions there. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>> and follow the instructions there. >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. > > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there.