Empathy List Archives

C

cdelect@juno.com

Sat, Feb 24, 2018 11:45 PM

Hi,

I'm working to make some replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A to the
new style schematic.

Will share the Gerber file when done.

The integrator capacitor is a 1986 vintage TRW 5.0ufd 50V 10% .42"DX1.0"L
axial.

Of course it has an HP part number and no manufactures #.

Any guess as to what type it is?

Polycarbonate, polypropylene, ???????

Just wanting to find a good modern replacement for its use. (Integrator
with a 50ms time constant.)

Thanks,

Corby

Hi, I'm working to make some replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A to the new style schematic. Will share the Gerber file when done. The integrator capacitor is a 1986 vintage TRW 5.0ufd 50V 10% .42"DX1.0"L axial. Of course it has an HP part number and no manufactures #. Any guess as to what type it is? Polycarbonate, polypropylene, ??????? Just wanting to find a good modern replacement for its use. (Integrator with a 50ms time constant.) Thanks, Corby

PK

Poul-Henning Kamp

Sat, Feb 24, 2018 11:51 PM

In message AABPKD8MDAT36FV2@smtpout03.dca.untd.com, cdelect@juno.com writes:

Any guess as to what type it is?

Polycarbonate, polypropylene, ???????

I think the manual says polypropylene in the parts list ?

Just wanting to find a good modern replacement for its use. (Integrator
with a 50ms time constant.)

The audiohomeopathy crowd claims to have PTFE/Teflon capacitors available
in these kinds of sizes and I've been meaning to buy one just to see if
it truly is PTFE or not, but list-prizes has nothing to do with reality.

--
Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20
phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956
FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe
Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence.

-------- In message <AABPKD8MDAT36FV2@smtpout03.dca.untd.com>, cdelect@juno.com writes: >Any guess as to what type it is? > >Polycarbonate, polypropylene, ??????? I think the manual says polypropylene in the parts list ? >Just wanting to find a good modern replacement for its use. (Integrator >with a 50ms time constant.) The audiohomeopathy crowd claims to have PTFE/Teflon capacitors available in these kinds of sizes and I've been meaning to buy one just to see if it truly is PTFE or not, but list-prizes has nothing to do with reality. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence.

BK

Bob kb8tq

Sat, Feb 24, 2018 11:56 PM

Hi

Teflon is the traditional “best of the best” for integrator caps. Simply finding
any plastic cap (other than a motor start device) up around 5 uf is not that easy
these days. As mentioned by PHK, being sure it is what it’s supposed to be ….
good luck.

Bob

On Feb 24, 2018, at 6:45 PM, cdelect@juno.com cdelect@juno.com wrote:

Hi,

I'm working to make some replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A to the
new style schematic.

Will share the Gerber file when done.

The integrator capacitor is a 1986 vintage TRW 5.0ufd 50V 10% .42"DX1.0"L
axial.

Of course it has an HP part number and no manufactures #.

Any guess as to what type it is?

Polycarbonate, polypropylene, ???????

Just wanting to find a good modern replacement for its use. (Integrator
with a 50ms time constant.)

Thanks,

Corby

time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

Hi Teflon is the traditional “best of the best” for integrator caps. Simply finding any plastic cap (other than a motor start device) up around 5 uf is not that easy these days. As mentioned by PHK, being sure it is what it’s supposed to be …. good luck. Bob > On Feb 24, 2018, at 6:45 PM, <cdelect@juno.com> <cdelect@juno.com> wrote: > > Hi, > > I'm working to make some replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A to the > new style schematic. > > Will share the Gerber file when done. > > The integrator capacitor is a 1986 vintage TRW 5.0ufd 50V 10% .42"DX1.0"L > axial. > > Of course it has an HP part number and no manufactures #. > > Any guess as to what type it is? > > Polycarbonate, polypropylene, ??????? > > Just wanting to find a good modern replacement for its use. (Integrator > with a 50ms time constant.) > > Thanks, > > Corby > > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there.

RL

Robert LaJeunesse

Sun, Feb 25, 2018 1:29 AM

Not too long ago I designed an integrator for a piezoelectric force transducer. The customer wanted a rock-solid output after a step load on the transducer. The capacitor of choice was PPS, used in surface mount form and less than 0.5uF total capacitance. With a particular PCB material chosen for low moisture absorption the drift ended up being in the 200uV/minute range (4mV in 20 minutes!). The capacitor of choice was PPS, and Kemet uses that for its 4.7uF radial lead part number SMR15475J50B14L16.5CBULK. Not cheap, but it's what I'd look at first.

Bob L.

Sent: Saturday, February 24, 2018 at 6:45 PM
From: cdelect@juno.com
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Subject: [time-nuts] Replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A

... The integrator capacitor is a 1986 vintage TRW 5.0ufd 50V 10% .42"DX1.0"L

axial.

...Just wanting to find a good modern replacement for its use. (Integrator

with a 50ms time constant.)

Not too long ago I designed an integrator for a piezoelectric force transducer. The customer wanted a rock-solid output after a step load on the transducer. The capacitor of choice was PPS, used in surface mount form and less than 0.5uF total capacitance. With a particular PCB material chosen for low moisture absorption the drift ended up being in the 200uV/minute range (4mV in 20 minutes!). The capacitor of choice was PPS, and Kemet uses that for its 4.7uF radial lead part number SMR15475J50B14L16.5CBULK. Not cheap, but it's what I'd look at first. Bob L. > Sent: Saturday, February 24, 2018 at 6:45 PM > From: cdelect@juno.com > To: time-nuts@febo.com > Subject: [time-nuts] Replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A > ... The integrator capacitor is a 1986 vintage TRW 5.0ufd 50V 10% .42"DX1.0"L > axial. > ...Just wanting to find a good modern replacement for its use. (Integrator > with a 50ms time constant.)

GH

Gerhard Hoffmann

Sun, Feb 25, 2018 1:34 AM

Am 25.02.2018 um 00:45 schrieb cdelect@juno.com:

Hi,

I'm working to make some replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A to the
new style schematic.

Will share the Gerber file when done.

The integrator capacitor is a 1986 vintage TRW 5.0ufd 50V 10% .42"DX1.0"L
axial.

Of course it has an HP part number and no manufactures #.

Any guess as to what type it is?

Polycarbonate, polypropylene, ???????

Just wanting to find a good modern replacement for its use. (Integrator
with a 50ms time constant.)

50 ms integration time and 5uF+-20% does not sound like a
leakage current problem. Polypropylene seems good enough.
Teflon would be a joke. I might even go with WIMA MKS4
(Polyester) if I had them in the drawer. Dielectric absorption
is also not a problem at these impedance levels and time constants.

When I recapped the electrolytics in my 4274A RLC bridge, it was
hard to find capacitors that fit the board footprint of the old ones.
Usually I had to choose 2 or 3 times the voltage so that they would
fit the board. But that is a luxury problem. :-)

<
https://www.digikey.de/products/de/capacitors/film-capacitors/62?k=&pkeyword=&FV=e340004%2Ce340007%2Ce340055%2C1f140000%2Cmu4.7%C2%B5F%7C2049%2Cmu5.1%C2%B5F%7C2049%2Cmu5%C2%B5F%7C2049%2Cffe0003e&quantity=0&ColumnSort=0&page=1&stock=1&pageSize=25
>

Mouser.com should have just as much.

regards, Gerhard

Am 25.02.2018 um 00:45 schrieb cdelect@juno.com: > Hi, > > I'm working to make some replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A to the > new style schematic. > > Will share the Gerber file when done. > > The integrator capacitor is a 1986 vintage TRW 5.0ufd 50V 10% .42"DX1.0"L > axial. > > Of course it has an HP part number and no manufactures #. > > Any guess as to what type it is? > > Polycarbonate, polypropylene, ??????? > > Just wanting to find a good modern replacement for its use. (Integrator > with a 50ms time constant.) 50 ms integration time and 5uF+-20% does not sound like a leakage current problem. Polypropylene seems good enough. Teflon would be a joke. I might even go with WIMA MKS4 (Polyester) if I had them in the drawer. Dielectric absorption is also not a problem at these impedance levels and time constants. When I recapped the electrolytics in my 4274A RLC bridge, it was hard to find capacitors that fit the board footprint of the old ones. Usually I had to choose 2 or 3 times the voltage so that they would fit the board. But that is a luxury problem. :-) < https://www.digikey.de/products/de/capacitors/film-capacitors/62?k=&pkeyword=&FV=e340004%2Ce340007%2Ce340055%2C1f140000%2Cmu4.7%C2%B5F%7C2049%2Cmu5.1%C2%B5F%7C2049%2Cmu5%C2%B5F%7C2049%2Cffe0003e&quantity=0&ColumnSort=0&page=1&stock=1&pageSize=25 > Mouser.com should have just as much. regards, Gerhard

BH

Bill Hawkins

Sun, Feb 25, 2018 3:26 AM

Corby

A time constant is calculated from R and C.

If 50 milliseconds is the correct number, R for 5 mfd is 10,000 ohms.

You could use an aluminum electrolytic for the capacitor.

Can you tell us where the 50 ms number came from?

Regards,
Bill Hawkins

-----Original Message-----
From: time-nuts [mailto:time-nuts-bounces@febo.com] On Behalf Of
cdelect@juno.com
Sent: Saturday, February 24, 2018 5:45 PM
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Subject: [time-nuts] Replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A

Hi,

I'm working to make some replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A to the
new style schematic.

Will share the Gerber file when done.

The integrator capacitor is a 1986 vintage TRW 5.0ufd 50V 10%
.42"DX1.0"L axial.

Of course it has an HP part number and no manufactures #.

Any guess as to what type it is?

Polycarbonate, polypropylene, ???????

Just wanting to find a good modern replacement for its use. (Integrator
with a 50ms time constant.)

Thanks,

Corby

time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

Corby A time constant is calculated from R and C. If 50 milliseconds is the correct number, R for 5 mfd is 10,000 ohms. You could use an aluminum electrolytic for the capacitor. Can you tell us where the 50 ms number came from? Regards, Bill Hawkins -----Original Message----- From: time-nuts [mailto:time-nuts-bounces@febo.com] On Behalf Of cdelect@juno.com Sent: Saturday, February 24, 2018 5:45 PM To: time-nuts@febo.com Subject: [time-nuts] Replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A Hi, I'm working to make some replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A to the new style schematic. Will share the Gerber file when done. The integrator capacitor is a 1986 vintage TRW 5.0ufd 50V 10% .42"DX1.0"L axial. Of course it has an HP part number and no manufactures #. Any guess as to what type it is? Polycarbonate, polypropylene, ??????? Just wanting to find a good modern replacement for its use. (Integrator with a 50ms time constant.) Thanks, Corby _______________________________________________ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.

E

ewkehren

Sun, Feb 25, 2018 11:35 AM

Corby is still asleep, on the old board it was 0.5 uF and 100K now 5 uF and 10K. Who knows what HP knew in the 60`s but it works and I dought that it is critical. No where is there any fine tuning like two resistors in seriesBert Kehren

Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A
-------- Original message --------From: Bill Hawkins bill.iaxs@pobox.com Date: 2/24/18 10:26 PM (GMT-05:00) To: 'Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement' time-nuts@febo.com Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A
Corby

A time constant is calculated from R and C.

If 50 milliseconds is the correct number, R for 5 mfd is 10,000 ohms.

You could use an aluminum electrolytic for the capacitor.

Can you tell us where the 50 ms number came from?

Regards,
Bill Hawkins

-----Original Message-----
From: time-nuts [mailto:time-nuts-bounces@febo.com] On Behalf Of
cdelect@juno.com
Sent: Saturday, February 24, 2018 5:45 PM
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Subject: [time-nuts] Replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A

Hi,

I'm working to make some replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A to the
new style schematic.

Will share the Gerber file when done.

The integrator capacitor is a 1986 vintage TRW 5.0ufd 50V 10%
.42"DX1.0"L axial.

Of course it has an HP part number and no manufactures #.

Any guess as to what type it is?

Polycarbonate, polypropylene, ???????

Just wanting to find a good modern replacement for its use. (Integrator
with a 50ms time constant.)

Thanks,

Corby

time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to
https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

Corby is still asleep, on the old board it was 0.5 uF and 100K now 5 uF and 10K. Who knows what HP knew in the 60`s but it works and I dought that it is critical. No where is there any fine tuning like two resistors in seriesBert Kehren Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A -------- Original message --------From: Bill Hawkins <bill.iaxs@pobox.com> Date: 2/24/18 10:26 PM (GMT-05:00) To: 'Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement' <time-nuts@febo.com> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A Corby A time constant is calculated from R and C. If 50 milliseconds is the correct number, R for 5 mfd is 10,000 ohms. You could use an aluminum electrolytic for the capacitor. Can you tell us where the 50 ms number came from? Regards, Bill Hawkins -----Original Message----- From: time-nuts [mailto:time-nuts-bounces@febo.com] On Behalf Of cdelect@juno.com Sent: Saturday, February 24, 2018 5:45 PM To: time-nuts@febo.com Subject: [time-nuts] Replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A Hi, I'm working to make some replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A to the new style schematic. Will share the Gerber file when done. The integrator capacitor is a 1986 vintage TRW 5.0ufd 50V 10% .42"DX1.0"L axial. Of course it has an HP part number and no manufactures #. Any guess as to what type it is? Polycarbonate, polypropylene, ??????? Just wanting to find a good modern replacement for its use. (Integrator with a 50ms time constant.) Thanks, Corby _______________________________________________ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. _______________________________________________ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.

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Replacement A9 boards for the HP 5065A