Hi Didier, I use ExpressPCB as well, but I send the ExpressPCB file to a company called Futurlec ( http://www.futurlec.com/PCBService.shtml ). They have reasonable prices. Because it is overseas it takes about three weeks to get the product back. So far I have been very impressed with the product I recieved. I have even had notches done in the four corners to fit a plastic box that came out very well. Also, There is a person who started to write his own version of layout program based off of the ExpressPCB program called "Copper Connection." ( http://www.robotroom.com/CopperConnection/index.html ) It is a bit more involved than the ExpressPCB program and does have GERBER files as a selection. However he charges for the program but it seems the prices are reasonable ( http://www.robotroom.com/CopperConnection/Buy.html ). 73....Bill....WB6BNQ Didier Juges wrote: >The way ExpressPCB works is that their free software produces boards in a proprietary format, and you have to pay to convert their design file to Gerber. > >Your mileage may vary but I found the combination of design tools learning curve, board quality and quick service to be worthwhile to me. > >I have tried Eagle twice and never could manage to build the models I needed. It may have been an issue of not finding the right tutorial but I have produced several ExpressPCB designs in less time than I have tried (unsuccessfully) to produce a single schematic in Eagle, let alone a PWB. Since it is a hobby that has become a business, time matters to me, design time and delivery. > >At that point, the cost of the Gerber becomes somewhat irrelevant. > >Note that you can make boards of any size in ExpressPCB. > >I am not advocating it is the best solution for everyone, I personally would like to be proficient with Eagle, but Express PCB works for me. > >Didier KO4BB > > > > >On August 11, 2016 10:45:45 PM CDT, Chris Albertson <albertson.chris@gmail.com> wrote: > > >>This seems totally backwards. Typically a Gerber file is something >>you make yourself on your computer then send it in for a prototype. >>Seems odd to buy them. >> >>I checked ExpressPCB prices and they are very high. I can get PCBs >>made quickly in the US for $3 per square inch, shipping included with >>$9 minimum order. And you don't buy the Gerbers. >> >>I notice ExpressPCB offers free software. But it is totally >>non-standard and you can't use it for anything other then for their >>service. Most people needing free PCB software use Eagle, some use >>Kicad or some others. But Eagle seems to be kind of a universal >>standard. >> >> >> >> >>On Thu, Aug 11, 2016 at 8:55 AM, Didier Juges <shalimr9@gmail.com> >>wrote: >> >> >>>I concur. I have been using ExpressPCB extensively over the last 2 >>> >>> >>years >> >> >>>with great satisfaction now that it is possible to get Gerber files >>> >>> >>from >> >> >>>them. >>>I typically use the mini board pro service (3 bare boards, 2 sided >>> >>> >>with >> >> >>>solder mask and silk screen) for prototypes and then buy the Gerbers >>> >>> >>-- >> >>Chris Albertson >>Redondo Beach, California >>_______________________________________________ >>time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>To unsubscribe, go to >>https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>and follow the instructions there. >> >> > > >

Bill, that is a great deal for $99 for the full package. Very easy to use and learn. Thanks for the link. Regards, Tom WA3PZI ----- Original Message ----- From: "wb6bnq" <wb6bnq@cox.net> To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" <time-nuts@febo.com> Sent: Friday, August 12, 2016 10:22 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Working with SMT parts. > Hi Didier, > > I use ExpressPCB as well, but I send the ExpressPCB file to a company > called Futurlec > ( http://www.futurlec.com/PCBService.shtml ). They have reasonable > prices. Because it is overseas it takes about three weeks to get the > product back. So far I have been very impressed with the product I > recieved. I have even had notches done in the four corners to fit a > plastic box that came out very well. > > Also, There is a person who started to write his own version of layout > program based off of the ExpressPCB program called "Copper Connection." > ( http://www.robotroom.com/CopperConnection/index.html ) It is a bit > more involved than the ExpressPCB program and does have GERBER files as a > selection. However he charges for the program but it seems the prices are > reasonable ( http://www.robotroom.com/CopperConnection/Buy.html ). > > 73....Bill....WB6BNQ > > > Didier Juges wrote: > >>The way ExpressPCB works is that their free software produces boards in a >>proprietary format, and you have to pay to convert their design file to >>Gerber. >> >>Your mileage may vary but I found the combination of design tools learning >>curve, board quality and quick service to be worthwhile to me. >> >>I have tried Eagle twice and never could manage to build the models I >>needed. It may have been an issue of not finding the right tutorial but I >>have produced several ExpressPCB designs in less time than I have tried >>(unsuccessfully) to produce a single schematic in Eagle, let alone a PWB. >>Since it is a hobby that has become a business, time matters to me, design >>time and delivery. >> >>At that point, the cost of the Gerber becomes somewhat irrelevant. >> >>Note that you can make boards of any size in ExpressPCB. >> >>I am not advocating it is the best solution for everyone, I personally >>would like to be proficient with Eagle, but Express PCB works for me. >> >>Didier KO4BB >> >> >> >> >>On August 11, 2016 10:45:45 PM CDT, Chris Albertson >><albertson.chris@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>>This seems totally backwards. Typically a Gerber file is something >>>you make yourself on your computer then send it in for a prototype. >>>Seems odd to buy them. >>> >>>I checked ExpressPCB prices and they are very high. I can get PCBs >>>made quickly in the US for $3 per square inch, shipping included with >>>$9 minimum order. And you don't buy the Gerbers. >>> >>>I notice ExpressPCB offers free software. But it is totally >>>non-standard and you can't use it for anything other then for their >>>service. Most people needing free PCB software use Eagle, some use >>>Kicad or some others. But Eagle seems to be kind of a universal >>>standard. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>On Thu, Aug 11, 2016 at 8:55 AM, Didier Juges <shalimr9@gmail.com> >>>wrote: >>> >>>>I concur. I have been using ExpressPCB extensively over the last 2 >>>> >>>years >>> >>>>with great satisfaction now that it is possible to get Gerber files >>>> >>>from >>> >>>>them. >>>>I typically use the mini board pro service (3 bare boards, 2 sided >>>> >>>with >>> >>>>solder mask and silk screen) for prototypes and then buy the Gerbers >>>> >>>-- >>> >>>Chris Albertson >>>Redondo Beach, California >>>_______________________________________________ >>>time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>>To unsubscribe, go to >>>https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>>and follow the instructions there. >>> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. >

Hi Bill, I used Futurlec once and I was very happy with the results, but now most of my projects involve quantities of 50 or more pieces so I have the production quantities PWB made and the product assembly done (parts procurement, soldering and test) in a very large far Eastern country, kinda like Apple but on a slightly smaller scale... I have now worked with the same company for 7-8 years and I am quite satisfied with the results and the prices, for well over 3,000 pieces in total. As long as there are no long lead parts, I get finished products in the DHL about 3-4 weeks ARO from emailing them the Gerber's. Didier KO4BB On August 12, 2016 9:22:42 AM CDT, wb6bnq <wb6bnq@cox.net> wrote: >Hi Didier, > >I use ExpressPCB as well, but I send the ExpressPCB file to a company >called Futurlec >( http://www.futurlec.com/PCBService.shtml ). They have reasonable >prices. Because it is overseas it takes about three weeks to get the >product back. So far I have been very impressed with the product I >recieved. I have even had notches done in the four corners to fit a >plastic box that came out very well. > >Also, There is a person who started to write his own version of layout > >program based off of the ExpressPCB program called "Copper >Connection." ( http://www.robotroom.com/CopperConnection/index.html ) > >It is a bit more involved than the ExpressPCB program and does have >GERBER files as a selection. However he charges for the program but it > >seems the prices are reasonable ( >http://www.robotroom.com/CopperConnection/Buy.html ). > >73....Bill....WB6BNQ > > >Didier Juges wrote: > >>The way ExpressPCB works is that their free software produces boards >in a proprietary format, and you have to pay to convert their design >file to Gerber. >> >>Your mileage may vary but I found the combination of design tools >learning curve, board quality and quick service to be worthwhile to me. >> >>I have tried Eagle twice and never could manage to build the models I >needed. It may have been an issue of not finding the right tutorial but >I have produced several ExpressPCB designs in less time than I have >tried (unsuccessfully) to produce a single schematic in Eagle, let >alone a PWB. Since it is a hobby that has become a business, time >matters to me, design time and delivery. >> >>At that point, the cost of the Gerber becomes somewhat irrelevant. >> >>Note that you can make boards of any size in ExpressPCB. >> >>I am not advocating it is the best solution for everyone, I personally >would like to be proficient with Eagle, but Express PCB works for me. >> >>Didier KO4BB >> >> >> >> >>On August 11, 2016 10:45:45 PM CDT, Chris Albertson ><albertson.chris@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >>>This seems totally backwards. Typically a Gerber file is something >>>you make yourself on your computer then send it in for a prototype. >>>Seems odd to buy them. >>> >>>I checked ExpressPCB prices and they are very high. I can get PCBs >>>made quickly in the US for $3 per square inch, shipping included with >>>$9 minimum order. And you don't buy the Gerbers. >>> >>>I notice ExpressPCB offers free software. But it is totally >>>non-standard and you can't use it for anything other then for their >>>service. Most people needing free PCB software use Eagle, some use >>>Kicad or some others. But Eagle seems to be kind of a universal >>>standard. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>On Thu, Aug 11, 2016 at 8:55 AM, Didier Juges <shalimr9@gmail.com> >>>wrote: >>> >>> >>>>I concur. I have been using ExpressPCB extensively over the last 2 >>>> >>>> >>>years >>> >>> >>>>with great satisfaction now that it is possible to get Gerber files >>>> >>>> >>>from >>> >>> >>>>them. >>>>I typically use the mini board pro service (3 bare boards, 2 sided >>>> >>>> >>>with >>> >>> >>>>solder mask and silk screen) for prototypes and then buy the Gerbers >>>> >>>> >>>-- >>> >>>Chris Albertson >>>Redondo Beach, California >>>_______________________________________________ >>>time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>>To unsubscribe, go to >>>https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>>and follow the instructions there. >>> >>> >> >> >> > >_______________________________________________ >time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >To unsubscribe, go to >https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >and follow the instructions there. -- Sent from my Moto-X wireless tracker while I do other things.

I just installed CopperConnection and it opens the ExpressPCB layouts just fine :) Thanks for the tip, I will give it a go. Didier KO4BB On August 12, 2016 9:22:42 AM CDT, wb6bnq <wb6bnq@cox.net> wrote: >Hi Didier, > >I use ExpressPCB as well, but I send the ExpressPCB file to a company >called Futurlec >( http://www.futurlec.com/PCBService.shtml ). They have reasonable >prices. Because it is overseas it takes about three weeks to get the >product back. So far I have been very impressed with the product I >recieved. I have even had notches done in the four corners to fit a >plastic box that came out very well. > >Also, There is a person who started to write his own version of layout > >program based off of the ExpressPCB program called "Copper >Connection." ( http://www.robotroom.com/CopperConnection/index.html ) > >It is a bit more involved than the ExpressPCB program and does have >GERBER files as a selection. However he charges for the program but it > >seems the prices are reasonable ( >http://www.robotroom.com/CopperConnection/Buy.html ). > >73....Bill....WB6BNQ > > >Didier Juges wrote: > >>The way ExpressPCB works is that their free software produces boards >in a proprietary format, and you have to pay to convert their design >file to Gerber. >> >>Your mileage may vary but I found the combination of design tools >learning curve, board quality and quick service to be worthwhile to me. >> >>I have tried Eagle twice and never could manage to build the models I >needed. It may have been an issue of not finding the right tutorial but >I have produced several ExpressPCB designs in less time than I have >tried (unsuccessfully) to produce a single schematic in Eagle, let >alone a PWB. Since it is a hobby that has become a business, time >matters to me, design time and delivery. >> >>At that point, the cost of the Gerber becomes somewhat irrelevant. >> >>Note that you can make boards of any size in ExpressPCB. >> >>I am not advocating it is the best solution for everyone, I personally >would like to be proficient with Eagle, but Express PCB works for me. >> >>Didier KO4BB >> >> >> >> >>On August 11, 2016 10:45:45 PM CDT, Chris Albertson ><albertson.chris@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >>>This seems totally backwards. Typically a Gerber file is something >>>you make yourself on your computer then send it in for a prototype. >>>Seems odd to buy them. >>> >>>I checked ExpressPCB prices and they are very high. I can get PCBs >>>made quickly in the US for $3 per square inch, shipping included with >>>$9 minimum order. And you don't buy the Gerbers. >>> >>>I notice ExpressPCB offers free software. But it is totally >>>non-standard and you can't use it for anything other then for their >>>service. Most people needing free PCB software use Eagle, some use >>>Kicad or some others. But Eagle seems to be kind of a universal >>>standard. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>On Thu, Aug 11, 2016 at 8:55 AM, Didier Juges <shalimr9@gmail.com> >>>wrote: >>> >>> >>>>I concur. I have been using ExpressPCB extensively over the last 2 >>>> >>>> >>>years >>> >>> >>>>with great satisfaction now that it is possible to get Gerber files >>>> >>>> >>>from >>> >>> >>>>them. >>>>I typically use the mini board pro service (3 bare boards, 2 sided >>>> >>>> >>>with >>> >>> >>>>solder mask and silk screen) for prototypes and then buy the Gerbers >>>> >>>> >>>-- >>> >>>Chris Albertson >>>Redondo Beach, California >>>_______________________________________________ >>>time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>>To unsubscribe, go to >>>https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>>and follow the instructions there. >>> >>> >> >> >> > >_______________________________________________ >time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >To unsubscribe, go to >https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >and follow the instructions there. -- Sent from my Moto-X wireless tracker while I do other things.

If you are looking for a free PCB layout program there are a few around. 1) Eagle cad https://cadsoft.io This one is the most popular by far. The free version is some limits, only two layers and only up to about 4 x 3 inch PCBs. Yes it can output Gerber files. For larger size PCBs and more layers you need to buy a license 2) Kicad http://kicad-pcb.org is completely free, No limits on size of number of layers. This is used in a lot of projects 3) gEDA tries to do everything. You enter the schematic and that can go into simulation or PCB layout http://wiki.geda-project.org There are more. The Wikipedia lists about a dozen of them https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_EDA_software On Fri, Aug 12, 2016 at 9:28 AM, Tom Miller <tmiller11147@verizon.net> wrote: > Bill, that is a great deal for $99 for the full package. Very easy to use > and learn. > > Thanks for the link. > > Regards, > Tom > WA3PZI > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "wb6bnq" <wb6bnq@cox.net> > To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" > <time-nuts@febo.com> > Sent: Friday, August 12, 2016 10:22 AM > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Working with SMT parts. > > >> Hi Didier, >> >> I use ExpressPCB as well, but I send the ExpressPCB file to a company >> called Futurlec >> ( http://www.futurlec.com/PCBService.shtml ). They have reasonable >> prices. Because it is overseas it takes about three weeks to get the >> product back. So far I have been very impressed with the product I >> recieved. I have even had notches done in the four corners to fit a plastic >> box that came out very well. >> >> Also, There is a person who started to write his own version of layout >> program based off of the ExpressPCB program called "Copper Connection." ( >> http://www.robotroom.com/CopperConnection/index.html ) It is a bit more >> involved than the ExpressPCB program and does have GERBER files as a >> selection. However he charges for the program but it seems the prices are >> reasonable ( http://www.robotroom.com/CopperConnection/Buy.html ). >> >> 73....Bill....WB6BNQ >> >> >> Didier Juges wrote: >> >>> The way ExpressPCB works is that their free software produces boards in a >>> proprietary format, and you have to pay to convert their design file to >>> Gerber. >>> >>> Your mileage may vary but I found the combination of design tools >>> learning curve, board quality and quick service to be worthwhile to me. >>> >>> I have tried Eagle twice and never could manage to build the models I >>> needed. It may have been an issue of not finding the right tutorial but I >>> have produced several ExpressPCB designs in less time than I have tried >>> (unsuccessfully) to produce a single schematic in Eagle, let alone a PWB. >>> Since it is a hobby that has become a business, time matters to me, design >>> time and delivery. >>> >>> At that point, the cost of the Gerber becomes somewhat irrelevant. >>> >>> Note that you can make boards of any size in ExpressPCB. >>> >>> I am not advocating it is the best solution for everyone, I personally >>> would like to be proficient with Eagle, but Express PCB works for me. >>> >>> Didier KO4BB >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On August 11, 2016 10:45:45 PM CDT, Chris Albertson >>> <albertson.chris@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> This seems totally backwards. Typically a Gerber file is something >>>> you make yourself on your computer then send it in for a prototype. >>>> Seems odd to buy them. >>>> >>>> I checked ExpressPCB prices and they are very high. I can get PCBs >>>> made quickly in the US for $3 per square inch, shipping included with >>>> $9 minimum order. And you don't buy the Gerbers. >>>> >>>> I notice ExpressPCB offers free software. But it is totally >>>> non-standard and you can't use it for anything other then for their >>>> service. Most people needing free PCB software use Eagle, some use >>>> Kicad or some others. But Eagle seems to be kind of a universal >>>> standard. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Aug 11, 2016 at 8:55 AM, Didier Juges <shalimr9@gmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I concur. I have been using ExpressPCB extensively over the last 2 >>>>> >>>> years >>>> >>>>> with great satisfaction now that it is possible to get Gerber files >>>>> >>>> from >>>> >>>>> them. >>>>> I typically use the mini board pro service (3 bare boards, 2 sided >>>>> >>>> with >>>> >>>>> solder mask and silk screen) for prototypes and then buy the Gerbers >>>>> >>>> -- >>>> >>>> Chris Albertson >>>> Redondo Beach, California >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>>> To unsubscribe, go to >>>> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>>> and follow the instructions there. >>>> >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to >> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. >> > > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. -- Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California

-------- In message <CABbxVHuWRk64L2KdykBQTYea164ZaD2gF+iqb-6UGkj5V3ybtQ@mail.gmail.com>, Chris Albertson writes: >1) Eagle cad > >2) Kicad I switched from Eagle to Kicad, and have used Seeed's PCB service with good results. Kicad got a major boost when CERN threw their weight behind it, and while Eagle is still slightly more polished in many ways, kicad is clearly where the party is. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence.